A Little Talk

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Central Facehuggeria
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Post by Central Facehuggeria »

Kanuckistan wrote: I'm not too fond of the 'nid idea myself - it still ultimately boils down to fairly traditional open war.
Which in this instance is the only plausible option. The ESUS alone is too varied for infiltration to work properly. We have 1984-esque dictatorships, overminds, space-hippies, space-elves (a subrace of space-hippies,)...

And besides, an internal problem is not one that will foster cooperation with the GFFA.
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Post by Sskiss »

I don't know about the Tyrannids. I actually thought the ESUS civil war was fun as it was and maybe something smaller scale is just the thing. Bigger stuff tends to just fall apart fairly quickly as we've all seen time and time again. As some of you may know, I partial to the "old school" of science fiction and warhammer 40k is just too "new" for me.

I like stuff along the lines of Larry Niven and Ian banks style RP's and feel. I've also found that RP's involving more than four people tend to die rather quick at any rate.

Another great scenario I like is the classic "balance of power" story where someone develops a powerful weapon or defensive system that could radically alter the balance of power in a given area or even the whole galaxy. Other possibilities include "trade wars" where one side attempts to secretly throttle the trade of another - especially if it involves certain precious elements that one or both sides (or just everyone) needs.

Anyhow, just throwing out some ideas.
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New Dornalia
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Post by New Dornalia »

Sskiss wrote:Another great scenario I like is the classic "balance of power" story where someone develops a powerful weapon or defensive system that could radically alter the balance of power in a given area or even the whole galaxy. Other possibilities include "trade wars" where one side attempts to secretly throttle the trade of another - especially if it involves certain precious elements that one or both sides (or just everyone) needs.

Anyhow, just throwing out some ideas.
Well, sci fi has moved on, man :).

Anyway, the idea of an imbalance scenario is old hat, unless somebody has a spare Halo hanging around or some similar weapon. I'd rather do something a little different. Also, a trade war would only prolong the conflict. Inevitably, it would restart the ESUS-GFFA War, when the point is that we're trying to find ways to make it end.

And besides, what is at stake here involves more than four people. It involves the whole of two alliances, which have to end this thing somehow. I'd rather end this thing with a bang then with a whimper and to only involve four people at a time, which is not the only amount per alliance, seems kinda odd to me.

As for the issue of "And besides, an internal problem is not one that will foster cooperation with the GFFA," well, as I imagine it, the Genestealer cult would be hurting both sides with massive internal problems that would be hurting with common characteristics everywhere.

Genestealers also tend to assume the shape of their targets in general; they don't just hurt humans, hell they can assimilate anybody and anything. And as I have said before, they do think ahead when it comes to dealing with local security. How else in a world as oppressive as Warhammer 40,000, with secret police with unlimited resources that use modified jet engines to burn people at the stake, can deputize regular army troops for their jobs, use specialized anti-psychic weaponry, and any number of fantastic tools that would make the Stasi, the Gestapo, and the Spanish Inquisition combined jealous--all for the flimsiest of reasons--are they able to get inside worlds and make a mess of things?

To me the challenge is, Genestealers are notoriously hard to ferret out before its too late, and again like Metallinauts said, its hard to tell when 'Nids come knocking--they might even decide to skip the knock and cut to the business of feeding their very large family instead, see.

The only successful case I really know of is of a Tau colony that was infiltrated with them, and it was only by the wiles of one merchant who was wise to their plot and a bunch of mercenaries that had not been infected by the Cult that the colony was saved. And this was with canon Genestealers!

So, by the time both sides wise up to the plot, it may be too late to avoid a massive hive invasion. The only cure would really be psychics or damned good secret policemen and surveillance--which I trust a lot of you guys have. However, who in even the most repressive and paranoid government would honestly believe that a cult of freaks worshipping some bugs would really be a threat? Besides, Genestealers would more than likely make friends in the highest of places in local governments, which would distrupt any investigation and effort to purge the cult.

This plan will also affect not just your alliance, but mine as well. Don't think I'm only doing this to you guys; I know very damn well that this will mean bugs and half-bugs will be streaming down the streets of Los Angeles, my capital, as well as your own. And frankly, I would welcome that, compared to the impasse as of now. Or would the skeptics prefer to keep the impasse going?
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Post by Otagia »

Actually, 'Stealers are relatively easy to stop with the proper resources. Just kill the Patriarch and until they can breed a new Purestrain (which takes at least... 90 years if you're starting from 1st Generation hybrids) the Cult is pretty much headless. That and the fact that 'stealers don't actually convert people, they have to impregnate their victims, wait for them to give birth, and then wait for the hybrids to mature... It only really works in the excesively large timescale available in 40K, as well as it's semi-primitive tech-base (as frankly, a half-decent prenatal exam should catch these things rather easily).

As for the INQ being unable to catch them: The Inquisition is far from all-seeing and ever present. There's a rather small number of them, with most planets going generations without seeing one, and even then, if the Inquisitor isn't looking for an infestation, he's probably not going to find it. If he is, the cults tend to be burned out. See Inquisition Wars, see Deathwing, see Crossfire (At least, I think it was Crossfire).
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Metallinauts
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Post by Metallinauts »

We aren't aiming for canon. :P :P :P

EDIT: In fact, it doesn't even have to be 'nids, it could be something based on 'nids
New Dornalia
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Post by New Dornalia »

Metallinauts wrote:We aren't aiming for canon. :P :P :P

EDIT: In fact, it doesn't even have to be 'nids, it could be something based on 'nids
True, ever so true. We don't have to stick to canon--I did postulate beforehand that we could assume evolution had taken its course and we're dealing with some Super Genestealers that can successfully create replicants of the target species, similar to those used on Starship Troopers Chronicles (in the later story arcs). In appearance, they would keep the shape of their foes; in psychic and genetic makeup, they could fool even a deaf, dumb and blind kid into thinking they're one of their own, though they would have some minor genetic flaws. And, they can make more in a worrying quick pace, either by assimilating others or by impregnating others.

EDIT: Also, one can say that in terms of factual accuracy, Black Library books can be just as bad and easily mutable as wikipedia can, often to the point where one must commit catgirl genocide (see my siggy for details) in order to get all the facts straight. An example is the size of the Lunar-class Cruiser--various estimates have given out anywhere from 3-30km in length for one of these guys!

EDIT2: May I also throw in the use of psychic powers beyond canon (such as suggestion, mindreading, and for Maguses, even VERY LIMITED Carrie-type stuff), and heck, just a general clause saying they evolved ways to counteract their flaws?
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New Dornalia
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Post by New Dornalia »

Alrighty then. I am still in favor of the Super Genestealers and I encourage others to consider them, and make the appropriate comments--but seeing as they're running into more than a little opposition, I'm also willing to entertain some of the other concepts thrown out here as well.
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Balrogga
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Post by Balrogga »

Whatever is decided upon, it is my opinion an outside threat will cause the desired effect long before any internal threat would.
Central Facehuggeria
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Post by Central Facehuggeria »

Balrogga wrote:Whatever is decided upon, it is my opinion an outside threat will cause the desired effect long before any internal threat would.
Seconded.
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New Dornalia
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Post by New Dornalia »

Duly noted. Anybody else wish for yea or nay upon the Super Genestealers? I have a feeling the last two votes were nay.....
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Every time you debate real science in a fantasy setting, God kills a catgirl.

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