ARt, Video Games, Capstone projects

[Derscon]

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic ... 19&t=41110

That sums it up, basically.

I'm posing it here, too, since we're all more gamers. I'd like ESUS's thoughts.

I'm also curious as to your thoughts in particular, Solar.

[Solar Communes]

You can compare Oblivion with Twilight and Fallout 3 with -insert movie sequel that ruined the franchise forever here-

[Derscon]

You can compare Oblivion with Twilight and Fallout 3 with -insert movie sequel that ruined the franchise forever here-

I was looking more for helpful comments stemming from your arrogance, rather than this unhelpful stuff. Rather than just telling me you hate everything, I was more hoping you could recommend - I know that might be hard for you - a few JRPGs and WRPGs for me to do.

[Solar Communes]

Besides the Black Isle Studios/Troika Games stuff I'd obviously recommend like Arcanum, Fallout 1 and 2 and Planescape:Torment and besides some good FPS+RPG hybrids like System Shock 2, Deus Ex and Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines, I'd recommend the following games:

JRPGs: Shin Megami Tensei: Persona 1 and 2, Earthbound and Terranigma

Notes: Earthbound(AKA: Mother 2) is a really cool game.

CRPGs: Betrayal at Krondor, Arx Fatalis and Prelude to Darkness

Notes: Betrayal at Krondor is really good at an in-between graphics and text-based presentation of events, it feels like a "choose your own adventure" book merged with a game done right. Smartly, instead of doing lots of shitty CGIs with 1993 tech, the developers took a path of using well-written description of things in certain parts of the game. The fact the author of the books that gave origin to the game's lore participated from its development shows.

Prelude to Darkness is a really good, freeware game at everything but, according to some, stability(funnily I never had any serious trouble with it. Give it a try, if it doesn't crash too often to make it unplayable, it is a good oldschool game that combines a nice story-driven and somewhat nonlinear plot with the ability to create an entire party of adventurers instead of a single character like in certain truly oldschool CRPGs that existed before I was even born and were lacking in the story and choices and consequences part.

Western Games that resemble JRPGs: Anachronox, Septerra Core

Notes: I really have to recommend Anachronox.

[Derscon]

Kickass, thanks!

Also, what criteria do you (general you) think I should be comparing games on? I really need to narrow this thing down a bit. I have some time, but still, I'd like to get this shit over and done with.

[Solar Communes]

First of all, I'd say games can be classified by nature of progression, both gameplay and story-wise:

Linear - Nonlinear

Pretty obvious, I believe. Also, when I mention both gameplay and story-wise, I mean that there is more to nonlinearity than a few inane dialogue choices that make cosmetic changes to a game/interactive movie being sold as game. A CRPG where the way the stats of a character were built limit what can be achieved regarding goals and where there are multiple means to solve a given goal is an example of nonlinearity in gameplay.

There is a difference between nonlinearity of goals, pathway and of means to achieve such goals. A game may have a very linear primary objective to be achieved, like for example Deus Ex and Thief series, but several ways to reach that point or achieve that goal instead of a single one. Likewise, a game may be very linear in its objectives, but allow you to accomplish such objectives at any order, regardless of how late objectives would logically be harder to achieve with a new character in a CRPG, for example. Risen and the Gothic games present an example of both this sort of nonlinearity and of nonlinearity of goals and means to achieve them. It doesn't have level scaling(which is an example of enforced linearity of challenge)

Then I'd go with goals regarding what kind of player experience the developers wished for:

Ego massage/"Achievement"-driven vs. Challenge

Ego massage is a game that is intentionally easy and simplified not only to be accessible to even someone with far below average IQ, but also to make the gamer feel he achieved something first and foremost(even if giving such sense of "achievement" requires for things that would increase the fun factor and replayability of the game to be eliminated), which will always be linear due to its nature(as a nonlinear game would block off potential inane "Achievements" and optional areas to flaunt about depending on the choices made during the game), for its goal is not to provide challenge, but to massage a player's ego, and thus, an easy game where you feel awesome because the huge monster is a pussy is the way to go, and of course:



Challenge is a game that doesn't give to the player the sense of being nearly undefeatable and that doesn't hand-hold everything because it wasn't made simply to cater to the ego of people desperate to feel proud about something and show it off to others, but to design challenge as an element to increase the fun factor(or at least, that is the way it should be). Some of these games may have as well areas that are "impassable"(unless you run away instead of fighting what comes) with a new character, like Risen and Gothic 2 for example, or with enemies that are almost unkillable with the starting weapons you get in the case of a FPS, but that is exactly the point, to give a sense of challenge and progression instead of being an invisible hand of ego masturbation. A game doesn't need to be a totally complex, ultra-complicated Goldbox CRPG that forces you to draw maps of dungeons for lacking an automap function and is filled with random encounters that can kill your party instantly to be challenging. In fact, challenge has nothing to do with complexity, but with how much the difficulty curve develops along the game and how far it goes. Doom 1 was a challenging game IMO, but obviously it's not something that requires the same amount of thinking a game like Hearts of Iron 2 does. Unfortunately, most next-gen games instead of seeking a smooth difficulty curve like classic FPSes have a difficulty "line" that is nearly flat. I didn't feel that the later levels of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare were particularly more frustrating than the previous ones because of the fact it was not challenging to me, but incredibly frustrating, whereas games I'd consider far more difficult that haven't led me to want to toss the keyboard away. I'd kill everybody involved with Halo if I could go back in time.

The Reason: Insta-regen + respawns + checkpoints = Frustration and repetitiveness.

I like multiplayer, but single-player shouldn't ever be treated as a mode for people who fail at MP games to feel themselves awesome. Or a lazily implemented, dull shooting gallery with insta-regen and cover . Fffffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu....

Passive vs. Active

It sounds contradictory that games, that are at first supposed to be interactive experiences, could be classified as passive entertainment. However, many games are crossing the boundary and getting very close to movies with mini-games known as Quick Time Events between each chapter/cutscene, although sometimes whack-a-mole shooting galleries with cover may replace that, putting them a little further from the extreme passive entertainment in this spectrum. As a very solid example of such characteristic I'd put Heavy Rain and as a not so blatant one the latest Final Fantasy.

Active gameplay is how it started before the FMV / CGI with Quick Time Events fads happened. The simplest way to define where a game ends in such spectrum is by having a rough estimate of how many minutes(or seconds in a game that is more active than passive) of cutscenes and completely linear character conversations with choices that exist only for flavor(something Bioware tends to do a lot) do exist for each minute of actual gameplay.

[Arenumberg]

You really should never compare linear and non-linear, considering games can never truely be non-linear as every option has to be coded and accounted for, thus making even the most outlandish choice - not really a choice, but simply a different path to a rehash of an ending.

Just my thoughts on that. You can compare illusion of choice available, I guess, but when you compare the above you always have that niggling feeling in the back of your mind that its kind of irrelevant as its just an illusion, thus, when you do the above.. it just starts to veer into time paradox territory.

THAT SAID

Roll on games that evolve and play differently instead of just pretending to be "vast".

[Solar Communes]

Also Pop-a-Mole gameplay from shitty action games with staring-at-the-butt(or over the shoulder) camera and dumbed down cover systems is the most bland, repetitive, and shitty gameplay fad ever invented since Gaylo started with regenerating health, and only mass-produced because it costs less to implement than real AIs and real action gameplay instead of a over-glorified repetition of Quick Time Events in over-glorified Whack-a-Moles with BLOOM and Soil Erosion.

Finally, it's easy to use linear and non-linear for making a distinction than linear and "multi-linear". And one more thing, there is a huge difference between illusion of choices and real choices in gameplay. In Fallout 1, there were real choices with different consequences in the way the game plot developed, whereas in -insert every Bioware game ever made here- most "choices" are purely cosmetic and change nothing. It's all the marketing drones thing that according to researches of POPAMOLE consoletards most of them won't replay a game so even if most of the choices are pure fluff, like in all Bioware games, they won't ever realize it and think "cool" about it. In other words, a scam

Now, for total rage:

Electronic Arts is going to charge for glorified demos

Why is videogames the most alienated, retarded and filled with idiots overall consumer market ever? I mean, some of the things done there that would get lawsuits in other areas actually end with a bunch of total idiots praising them as they are drained of their bucks paying $10 for horse armor?

*Edit:

http://xboxlive.ign.com/articles/107/1079073p1.html

This is the key to understand the FAIL that is Xbawks Live