Proposal: Terra No Longer Exists

[Kostemetsia]

RECOGNISING that a faction known as the Terran Alliance once claimed Sol;

RECOGNISING that, some time ago, the cohesive central government of that faction was destroyed by a cohesive military endeavour on the part of the Hermes allied group;

RECOGNISING that some galactic traffic still flies the flag of the Terran Alliance for reasons unknown;

RECOGNISING that that galactic traffic includes battle-ready vessels;

THE ESUS SENATE ceases recognising any claims of sovereignty or legitimacy on the part of the Terran Alliance:

MEANING THAT any battleship flying the flag of the Terran Alliance will be recognised as a heavily armed civilian vessel and dealt with appropriately under local law;

MEANING THAT any cargo vessel flying the flag of the Terran Alliance will be flying unregistered and, again, dealt with appropriately under local law;

MEANING THAT the ESUS and its signatories are no longer obliged to recognise as valid any communique from any faction claiming to constitute the legitimate Terran Alliance;

MEANING THAT any attempt on behalf of any faction claiming to be the Terran Alliance to forcibly enter the space of any ESUS signatory, or to impair the passage of traffic from any ESUS signatory through the space formerly regulated by the legitimate Terran Alliance, will be recognised as an act of terrorism under ESUS law and dealt with appropriately.

To become effective immediately upon the passage of this measure.

---

tl;dr official ESUS ignore of Rob.

As it's a fairly broad thing, it works like this:
- Rob was removed from Earth some time ago by Hermes. A lot of people are recognising this on an individual basis, apparently, except - obviously - Rob.
- Rob is being hostile towards IRON and ESUS members OOC for reasons he refuses to explain.

As such,
- Any TFU warship in any ESUS territory will be treated as a terrorist vessel and dealt with appropriately.
- Any TFU freighter in any ESUS territory will be treated as a pirate vessel and dealt with appropriately.
- Any official communication or threat from TFU will be ignored.

[Solar Communes]

The Solarians are above petty drama. They simply don't care.

[Arenumberg]

No.

I cant and wont follow this for a number of reasons.

[The Mindset]

Side effects of this proposal:

One, it's tantamount to recognising Hermes as a legitimate entity capable of removing nations from territory, therefore establishing it as a de facto reality, therefore implying that Hermes is a dictator of reality above the ESUS;

Two, it's essentially an ICly worded version of an OOC proposal and therefore falls into a grey area of lawful boundaries;

Three, I believe ignoring should be left to individual members discretion;

Four, Terra exists - I have territory there.

Therefore I vote no.

[Kostemetsia]

1) I thought it was more recognising Hermes on the same level as the ESUS.

2) This is utterly IC. Not based on anything OOC at all.

3) Something could be arranged along those lines. Not everyone obeys the UN, IRL, and we have the capacity to turn a blind eye.

4) Terra as in TFU.

[The Mindset]

1) I thought it was more recognising Hermes on the same level as the ESUS.

2) This is utterly IC. Not based on anything OOC at all.

3) Something could be arranged along those lines. Not everyone obeys the UN, IRL, and we have the capacity to turn a blind eye.

4) Terra as in TFU.

Hermes is not on the same level as the ESUS.

It's not utterly IC.

Then what's the point of a blanket ignore?

Fair enough.

Additional point: this has been tried before, and it failed.

[Kostemetsia]

Why not? If they're doing something useful it behoves us to recognise them.

It's not? I wasn't aware.

A blanket ignore says we, as a group, disapprove strongly of TFU's actions both IC and OOC. As long as exceptions to the ignore aren't made special note of, that assertion will remain.

[Kanuckistan]

The Dominion rejects any attempt, by any member state, to impose changes in the foreign policy of sovereign nations in relations to a third party, on such farcical grounds as those presented.

This matter should be below the notice of the Senate.

[Arenumberg]

I'll just chime in here, your rewriting history to cover your ignore - If TFU was "obliterated" once, (And I have been twice) - whats to stop you from chronomancing me, for example, out of the picture if I should annoy you? (Which your not helping me be less conducive to?)

Indeed, I'm in LAN (As is TFU) and will act accordingly.

I'll also point out that ESUS is not allowed by its nature to dictate sovereign policy in the way this vote is worded, Its upto individual states to deal with things like this, unless I'm grossly misunderstand what ESUS stands for.

I will not, along with others, I hope - Allow the ESUS to be IC'ly used to satisfy the OOC problems you have with a certain individual. Its been tried before.

[The Mindset]

Why not? If they're doing something useful it behoves us to recognise them.

It's not? I wasn't aware.

A blanket ignore says we, as a group, disapprove strongly of TFU's actions both IC and OOC. As long as exceptions to the ignore aren't made special note of, that assertion will remain.

Recognising and endorsing are two very different things. The ESUS should not stoop to the level of Hermes, because Hermes is so far beneath us that raising ourselves back up would be difficult.

Yeah, it's not strictly IC. You're using OOC reasoning for an IC action. This is called metagaming, and is a big no no.

I maintain that foreign policy (including ignores) should remain the domain of individual nations. The ESUS isn't a political bloc.